Unscripted conversations on the radio are not always quite as unscripted as they seem, as a great deal of work has often gone into preparing for the event and making notes of what you would like to say on any aspect of the themes to be discussed, in the hope that you can say as much of what you want to say as clearly and precisely as possible in the extremely restrictive time constraints that are usually in operation.

This Sunday morning discussion was essentially framed within a primarily Christian context, so I also had to have my opinions clear as to what I thought might be useful for the predominantly Christian audience. For this I must give credit to John Drane for his ideas on Postmodernism and Christianity that he expounded in lectures at Stirling University as part of a course in which I was involved. Check out his books for more.

Science

Galileo - view of church as authority not church as community

Enlightenment took empirical scientific method from muslims and separated it from faith context.

Science seen as competing with, rather than complementary to, religion as a description of observed experience.

Scientific theory as dogmatic faith

I believe in ‘science’ (says Richard Dawkin/Lewis Wolpert)

(Scientific method - throw away the results that don’t fit - experimental error)

Challenge current theory & be sneered at as ‘unscientific’ rather than setting science in its historical reality of constant self-destruction and re-invention.

This century’s scientific dogma reduces our life experience to

‘Relativity, Uncertainty, Indeterminacy, Chaos’

Beautiful science, but a purposeless description of existence

Detachment of faith perspective from scientific visionaries

Einstein’s talk of God seen as eccentricity, not intelligence

Isaac Newton only known as a mathematician, not a Bible scholar

Modernism

The Modernist Church

Every week 7,500 in Western Europe (230 in Scotland) leave Christianity

(at present rates, Christianity non-existent in 10 years,  possibly faster due to ageing population)

c.f. in Africa - Every day 17,500 become Christian

60% of Christians are not “white-western”

Post Modern perceptions

Suspicion of large scale or universal explanations

          “I’ll find my own truth for myself”

Distrust of claims of objectivity

          “I’ll trust my feelings, not your dogma”

Pluralism & Relativism

          “Your story or mine, who cares”

Mix & Match

          “Wisdom from many different sources”

Spirituality not Religion

          “Worship without Church”

Redefining Spirituality

Redefining Christianity

Quotes

Not “you believe, then you belong” but vice versa (Gutierrez?)

What you do, not what you think

c.f. Prophet “don’t say that you have faith, rather that you have submitted” to God’s way of life

Qur'an “Woe to those who pray and are heedless of their prayers, to those who make display and refuse charity”

Anselm of Canterbury  “I do not seek to understand that I may believe, but I believe that I may understand” - Unless I believe, I will not understand

Henry James  “Especially in the religious sphere, belief that formulas are true can never wholly take the place of personal experience”

Emil Brunner  “The Church took a wrong turning when it substituted the techniques of the classroom for the techniques of the community”

informing/teaching, or shared learning?

Dean Inge  “A church which is married to the spirit of its age will be a widow in the next”

following scientific/philosophic fashion rather than acting as its context

Islamic community growth

Questionable statistics - complex situation

In fact, in one way mosques in similar situation to churches

In early eighties parents said “We are losing our children - By the time they leave school they want nothing to do with us or our religion"

Yet these children, now young adults would probably still define themselves as muslim - in as much as they are part of the muslim community

Depends how you define muslim - cultural/commitment

Cultural/communal identity or personal faith and conviction

A minority defined by the majority - usually recognisable by skin colour

(muslim/hindu distinction within Asian community)

Births, marriages and deaths muslims

Communal fasting and feastdays

Self-definition as distinct from ‘Christian’ majority

Definition by the ‘other’ c.f. Old Firm Christians

Identity in the face of persecution and prejudice

(racism plus serious media denigration - I find it extremely difficult to read any newspaper, watch any TV news or documentary, that involves anything to do with Islam or the muslims, the ignorance and bigotry is so intense. What do you think it’s like for young muslims with no real counter-arguments at their disposal)

Half-truths (often worse than lies), extremes taken as normative

From undisguised loathing (Kilroy) to patronising pseudo-liberalism

But Islam may be disparaged but it’s rarely treated as a joke - like Christianity - so in a way the hatred is bonding, it recognises faith’s value. When you were thrown to the lions for being a Christian no one thought that it wasn’t important.

Problems for muslim community reflected in Christian situation - easier to see when the general assumptions of a basic Christian context to our culture are not there.

School - a secular materialist, rationalist, reductionist view of life is the context of an education system taught by professionals, paid for out of taxes, with legally compulsory attendance, and in which a few minutes a week are allotted to RME for our children’s faith and values education.

Faith is supposed to be taken care of at home, by unsupported, unpaid, untrained amateurs, in competition with the full might of the leisure industries. Such education is really a complete inversion of setting understanding in a context of faith rather than the other way about.

Faith must be seen to be action relevant to society if it is to regain any status in the community.

The Christian message must be seen to influence politics

(in Islam there is no distinction etc.)

Graham Blount - The Church of Scotland has more elders than the Labour Party has members, and a bigger social welfare budget than any town outside Glasgow

Yet one is considered a political irrelevance.

Divide and rule of faith communities has worked to destroy them

They have done this themselves.

Church not about authority but community

Can churches unite in recognition of Christ’s example?

ACTS is a start

The Name - The Church of Scotland should be dropped as a misnomer

perhaps - Church in Scotland would be a more suitable umbrella

Christians must be able to demonstrate that Secularism is not the only alternative to religious bigotry and warfare

Muslims would welcome a resurgence of Christianity if it reflected Christ’s example (as opposed to the Crusader/Inquisition example)

How about a Scottish Faith coalition?

Young people have ideals as much as ever (Red Nose Day)

The number of converts to Islam is often given great stress (part of the muslim ‘threat’ - ‘taking over the country'), but is not really numerically relevant to society.

I have spent years working with organisations set up to deal with converts, and frankly there were not really enough to warrant an organisation.

But those who do convert seem to follow certain patterns which might be of interest to christians

Largest number come not through proselytisation, but through a personal friendship (usually falling in love with a muslim), seeing Islam through the example of an individual, and then perhaps through the caring friendship of family/community. Islam in life and action, not theory.

A tiny minority through personal/private study/exploration, perhaps a direct connection with the Qur’an, or more usually Sufi mystical literature

People rarely transfer allegiance from one faith to another - they come out of agnosticism/uncertainty, out of the empty secular/materialism of society

At its heart a simplicity of understanding - no need for doctrinal allegiance

A Way of Life involving a recognition of God’s existence, and accepting that our lives are set in a greater context, with meaning and purpose, and justice for our worldly actions in a life to come.